tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post1131800647795112116..comments2024-01-05T06:18:18.086-05:00Comments on CommentaramaPolitics: The Doubleplusgood World of NewthinkAndrewPricehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.comBlogger67125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-73748006813241031122012-11-21T15:37:07.705-05:002012-11-21T15:37:07.705-05:00Indi, We're talking about two separate things....Indi, We're talking about two separate things. Of course, the GOP needs to start campaigning in those places and they need to seek out the good people.<br /><br />BUT as a matter of policy, we need to stop idealizing groups of people. It does not help to assume that all people on welfare are these honest, hard-working people who have somehow been unfairly trapped by an evil system or hard luck. There may be some, but the realize is that the vast majority are quite happy living off the government. And if we don't realize that and put in place policies that force the unwilling to get off the government gravy train, then nothing will change. But you can't do that if you assume that everyone is ready to respond to positive stimulus. If that were the case, we could end welfare tomorrow by asking employers to go through these neighbors and offer jobs to people. But that doesn't work because the majority of these people don't want a job, don't want to work, and aren't interested in joining the rest of the country.AndrewPricehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-3517998530815050442012-11-21T13:44:29.813-05:002012-11-21T13:44:29.813-05:00Andrew
This is a really sore point for me because...Andrew<br /><br />This is a really sore point for me because the GOP abandoned Mark's campaign. He got no money. We operated on a shoestring and the only reason he won the primary and did as well as he did was the fact that he motivated so many young republicans to go out and help. BTW, ironically enough most of the young guys helping out were ex military enlisted hispanics, no idea why.<br /><br />Everyone kept giving us the same aqrgument you do about the losers on welfare and yes they are there and they are bought. Problem was in 94 EVERYONE hated Corrine Brown including her own party. She had a serious primary challenge from a Black man reputed to have been related to Ron Brown of the Clinton Whitehouse sent there to take her out and if the election were honest he would have.<br /><br />The minority aspect of that district was only 45%. Had we gotten to the 5 to 10% that did want out and they are there becasuse they are the ones that did come out to support us. Many were children with parents who were losers who somehow weren't. Had we had the resources to market to them and to fight the election fraud in those 10 precincts I am sure we could have won. <br /><br />Part of the problem is the local parties are not willing to spend the capital on minority districts to get any votes there whatsoever. So the GOP is silent and the Progs are unchallenged in that community. This is why you see the Miami Dade area going 80% for the PRogs.Individualisthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11005025873042230314noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-79503136054086355182012-11-20T11:41:56.145-05:002012-11-20T11:41:56.145-05:00Thanks Eric! I'll check it out in a bit! Her...Thanks Eric! I'll check it out in a bit! Here's the link: <a href="http://www.adrive.com/public/J6MGSt/November%2018%20The%20Koz%20Effect%20PENELOPE%20LOMBARD,%20ERIC%20PORVAZNIK%20and%20LAURENCE%20WHYTE.mp3" rel="nofollow">LINK</a>AndrewPricehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-91869414924289844872012-11-20T09:24:40.653-05:002012-11-20T09:24:40.653-05:00T-Rav, in all fairness, animism isn't an exact...T-Rav, in all fairness, animism isn't an exact corollary to whatever it is that liberalism has become. Certainly the environmentalist proclivities of the average liberal border on animism and totemism, but there are also elements of imperial cultism, monism, gnostic utopianism, and something that I can only describe as future-worship. tryanmaxhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09881154741574720094noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-21310706779892981062012-11-20T00:17:45.445-05:002012-11-20T00:17:45.445-05:00Here ya go, Andrew (and Commentarama funsters), my...Here ya go, Andrew (and Commentarama funsters), my sending a statist (screw it, I'm done calling them modern liberals or progressives -- they're neither and it's past time to call them anything than what they are) over the edge more than once with those pesky things called facts, via the podcast from yesterday's "The Koz Effect" on RadioTitans.com:<br /><br />http://www.adrive.com/public/J6MGSt/November%2018%20The%20Koz%20Effect%20PENELOPE%20LOMBARD,%20ERIC%20PORVAZNIK%20and%20LAURENCE%20WHYTE.mp3EricPhttp://www.threedonia.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-16163700664585807922012-11-20T00:17:05.636-05:002012-11-20T00:17:05.636-05:00Liberalism as the modern form of animism. Hmmm. I&...Liberalism as the modern form of animism. Hmmm. I'll have to remember that and give it some thought. Maybe I can make my leftie friends upset and confused at the same time.T-Ravhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10861218035729479354noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-29061558603057898822012-11-19T22:17:57.956-05:002012-11-19T22:17:57.956-05:00Kit, Nice! It's time that Hollywood did their...Kit, Nice! It's time that Hollywood did their fair share... it's patriotic to pay taxes after all.AndrewPricehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-51470323504151510602012-11-19T22:14:46.744-05:002012-11-19T22:14:46.744-05:00"I think a billionaire/millionaire wealth tax..."I think a billionaire/millionaire wealth tax would be a lot of fun, and we could get the jackals of the left to support it. I bet the egalitarian Hollywood star would straighten out, real fast."<br /><br />I like that.<br />Glenn Reynolds has a few more suggestions:<br /><a href="http://washingtonexaminer.com/sunday-reflection-repeal-the-hollywood-tax-cuts/article/2503964" rel="nofollow">LINK</a>Kithttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01453591141757808708noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-14498518738542904482012-11-19T22:11:58.261-05:002012-11-19T22:11:58.261-05:00tryanmax, I agree. I've seen time and again w...tryanmax, I agree. I've seen time and again where they simply dismiss bad results as being caused by anything except their guy and their ideas. That's why I don't think liberals can be reached.<br /><br />Actual moderates can however (as compared to liberals who just want to believe they are moderates). Reaching moderates requires (1) that they suffer a horrible result from liberal policies which can't be explained away by some other supposed cause and (2) non-mean Republicans offering them an enticing fantasy result.<br /><br />Note that I don't think they are smart or grounded in reality -- they are in fact delusional fools, but they can be won over with a better lie if they "feel" that liberalism isn't working... unlike liberals who simply redefine all good things a being from liberals and all bad being from conservatives.AndrewPricehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-8071514839889749232012-11-19T22:05:31.606-05:002012-11-19T22:05:31.606-05:00Andrew, that is also why it's pointless to tal...Andrew, that is also why it's pointless to talk about results with liberals. I'm of the mind that they honestly don't care whether things in the present are good so long as they can believe in some imagined, glorious future. And, of course, that belief hinges on "their guy" being in control. Results only matter insofar as they can blame anyone other than their guy for them either to keep him in power or to make way for him to gain more power. Actually, in a sick, twisted way, I can sort of understand it, though I am loathe to explain it. Liberalism has become the modern form of animism. tryanmaxhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09881154741574720094noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-43101139881576899782012-11-19T21:49:48.495-05:002012-11-19T21:49:48.495-05:00tryanmax, I see that all the time among liberals. ...tryanmax, I see that all the time among liberals. They really do think like that. They will take anything and spin it so that the Democrat is just trying to help people and the Republicans is trying to hurt you, no matter what it is. The mental contortions are astounding to watch and, quite frankly, rather scary to observe. These people really are using "thought processes" that a reasonable observer would conclude represent genuine insanity -- a break from reality, yet liberals do this all the time and think nothing of it.<br /><br />That more than anything makes me realize that politics is not about rational argument, it's about telling a more believable story.<br /><br />On his SS/Medicare, it's the NIMB syndrome -- Not In My Backyard. Everybody thinks the other guy doesn't deserve his benefits, but how dare you suggest that I don't deserve mine!!<br />AndrewPricehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-13196414314326621302012-11-19T21:39:39.864-05:002012-11-19T21:39:39.864-05:00Andrew, it isn't just the ones on welfare, eit...Andrew, it isn't just the ones on welfare, either. My grandfather, staunch Democrat, is of a sort that would rather die than take welfare (but don't touch his SS or Medicare--he paid for those). Yet he applies the same Democrat=Good/Republican=Bad formula to everything. I've always summed it up thus:<br /><br />If a Democrat pushes you down, he must have had a good reason for it. And if a Republican tries to help you up, he's just trying to get something from you. tryanmaxhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09881154741574720094noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-49685335324475755212012-11-19T21:09:10.861-05:002012-11-19T21:09:10.861-05:00Eric, On that point, I have to say that is positiv...Eric, On that point, I have to say that is positively DRIVES ME NUTS! I can't tell you how many liberals I know who just do that -- if it was good, it must have been the Democrats who did it. It makes me want to smack these people.<br /><br />What's more, they don't want to hear the truth. They simply refuse to believe any evidence to the contrary.AndrewPricehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-31994742656645721152012-11-19T21:00:16.742-05:002012-11-19T21:00:16.742-05:00Yup, Andrew, silly me.Yup, Andrew, silly me.EricPhttp://www.threedonia.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-7780563833921678862012-11-19T20:57:22.357-05:002012-11-19T20:57:22.357-05:00Joel, And don't forget how many of them are mu...Joel, And don't forget how many of them are multi-generational criminals. Crime runs in families and let me assure you, they have no guilt or desire to do anything else. They just don't like being punished.AndrewPricehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-50758330235307467062012-11-19T20:55:08.246-05:002012-11-19T20:55:08.246-05:00Joel, Isn't that the truth. I'm amazed ho...Joel, Isn't that the truth. I'm amazed how many people fell for the "we're just an old couple who are down on our luck" story only to wake up and find their homes stripped. And how many people gave money for "food" or "medicine" only to see the same person buying DVDs at WalMart with it an hour later. These people are incredibly good at preying on people's sense of charity.<br />AndrewPricehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-36571870493688404952012-11-19T20:37:16.294-05:002012-11-19T20:37:16.294-05:00Andrew,
You forgot one thing, most of the ones on...Andrew,<br /><br />You forgot one thing, most of the ones on welfare are very good con artists. Joel Farnhamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15856960977033430002noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-20636052747813367852012-11-19T20:06:57.658-05:002012-11-19T20:06:57.658-05:00Indi, I'm sure there are good people like you ...Indi, I'm sure there are good people like you describe, but let me be very clear... most of the people I have met on welfare are not good people. They are not "trapped" or "helpless." They are not waiting for that one lucky break to give them the dignity they need to move forward and become productive members of society again.... no.<br /><br />The people I have met have worked hard to get into the system because they don't want to work. They want to spend their days drinking, smoking, watching television, f*cking and playing on the internet. If you offered them the ideal job tomorrow, they would not take it unless they saw a chance to rob the cash drawer on the first night.<br /><br />These people take drugs (meth), steal, abuse their kids, smoke like crazy, drink more than you think is possible (finding a 0.40 blood alcohol was common). They rent apartments and strip them of copper and appliances. They stage car accidents to sue insurance companies for injury. And for fun, they go out and hurt people because it makes them feel powerful.<br /><br />This is what you will find throughout West Virginia, Pennsylvania and parts of Eastern Ohio. These people number in the tens of thousands. The welfare roles are full of them. And people need to stop idealizing these human leeches.<br /><br />Again, I'm sure there are good people, but let's not pretend that welfare is a trap that somehow pulls otherwise good people in and victimizes them. Good people need a hand up, I agree, but the rest need to be dropped.AndrewPricehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-41741956888113302762012-11-19T19:50:47.648-05:002012-11-19T19:50:47.648-05:00Eric, That's the problem. The formula is:
1....Eric, That's the problem. The formula is:<br /><br />1. Always true = Republican policies will hurt you.<br /><br />2. Always true = Republicans have evil intent.<br /><br />3. If Republicans want something good, they have bad motives, don't let them hurt you with good things.<br /><br />4. If Republicans do something good, they did it under protest because Democrats wanted it even if they fought it.<br /><br />5. All good deeds will eventually be reclassified as having been passed by Democrats.AndrewPricehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-13208317436334960022012-11-19T19:28:59.252-05:002012-11-19T19:28:59.252-05:00>>If the GOP starts programs in the Hoods de...>>If the GOP starts programs in the Hoods designed to get people off welfare and do it in such a way that they people getting the help know the Republicans are offering it and we help a few out, eventually you will get others that are willing to sign up. >><br /><br />You mean like the "welfare to work" program Wisconsin's Tommy Thompson successfully implemented in the 1990s (which I'm proud to say my social worker mother was a part of before she returned to Ohio and that state's similar and also successful welfare to work), which provided the model for Congress' eventually getting President Clinton to enact? The same ones recently gutted by President Obama? Welcome to Short-Attention-Span Theatre, what we fans of Marat/Sade usually call the Theatre of Cruelty.<br /><br />http://dailycaller.com/2012/01/24/cbc-chairman-african-americans-would-march-on-the-white-house-if-obama-wasnt-black/EricPhttp://www.threedonia.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-63059153061343410552012-11-19T17:58:18.376-05:002012-11-19T17:58:18.376-05:00Andrew
I understande that the lost are goibng to ...Andrew<br /><br />I understande that the lost are goibng to be what they are. Many are giving up hope and don't see any better way out. The blacks in projects and the white trash in the trailer parks are not all that different. If anything one could state that Baracks domestic policy motto is "Welfare, its not just for Black People anymore, all are welcome".<br /><br />But I have been down in that hood and I have talked to people that hate being on welfare, hate the system and want out. Coincidently they think that the "Man" who is holding them down a rich white Republican.<br /><br />If the GOP starts programs in the Hoods designed to get people off welfare and do it in such a way that they people getting the help know the Republicans are offering it and we help a few out, eventually you will get others that are willing to sign up. <br /><br />No the slackers won't but they are lost anyways and the only reason they vote Andrew is the democrats come knocking on the door making threats. The reason they could do this at the precint I watched was the fact that the Poll Workers were never rotated by the city, were all people that lived there and were big Corrine fans. They knew if you voted and if you didn't, came to let you knoww it and when you showed up there were partisons manning the booths and collecting the ballots. Did these women manipulate them probably not, but that is because their presence was all that was needed to send the message. Plus everyone in the community knew you voted for the Progs because the GOP was never around.<br /><br />I know they were not around because MArk had an organization with 25 unpaid volunteers, young people like I was and some older that worked for him every day after work and all day Saturday and Sunday. This was because he had a local GOP based talk show right after Rush and was a black man unafraid to stand up to Sister Corrine publicly when every one else in the party laid down and took her crap or ignored her.<br /><br />Yet despite this the Duval county party gave us nothing in monetary support citing that the minority district was impossible except at the very last week when Mark actually closed the polls to a winnable level but it was toom little too late. They then blamed Mark after he lost.<br /><br />Well there blindness backcfired another way. At 6 when a buss parked down the street and flooded the precinct and 300 people showed up someeone got on the intercom and the fire station and said "vote for Chiles" three times. to this day I think a bribe was paid by Chiles as he was hurting in the polls vs Bush. He was reelected.<br /><br />You want that 5% break in minority ciommunities you got to go into the HOOD. You have to be seen in the projects. The way you do that is to go in there and find the few people you can help, the few that do want out of the life and help them help themselves. You start doing that day in day out and you will see real changes because the Progs are only there every two years and the main presence is landlords and ministers on the DNC gravy train.<br /><br />I will say this we lost that election but the political campaign volunteers of that election went into the damned hood more than any Republican since.Individualisthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11005025873042230314noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-7530260128502509032012-11-19T16:58:00.100-05:002012-11-19T16:58:00.100-05:00Stan, I'm not really sure that Europe failing ...Stan, I'm not really sure that Europe failing is a bad thing for us. Our future lies in Asia -- China, India, Southeast Asia. And as Europe falls apart, it just makes it that much easier for our companies to profit in the growing markets.<br /><br />I'd love to see a billionaire/millioniare wealth tax (especially targeted at Hollywood and Silicon Valley), but I doubt the Democrats will ever allow it. Their anti-rich stance is just rhetorical after all.<br /><br />Team Parasite indeed.AndrewPricehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-53962988967155034792012-11-19T16:53:29.367-05:002012-11-19T16:53:29.367-05:00The EU is a cluster phuck of monumental proportion...The EU is a cluster phuck of monumental proportions. The sad part they could drag us down with them redo 1929, and all the fun that followed.<br /><br />The French are stupid, nuff said.<br /><br />Now they are really to big too fail, woops that’s right there’ll be no more fake money to save them.<br /><br />The true vultures of Hostess were indeed the unions. Good object study for thinking Americans. <br /><br />I think a billionaire/millionaire wealth tax would be a lot of fun, and we could get the jackals of the left to support it. I bet the egalitarian Hollywood star would straighten out, real fast.<br /><br />Team Parasite (47%) is exactly why Romney lost. Along with the evangelicals, the Paulistas, and hardcore conservatives. <br />StanHhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07395708786509590321noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-52102792680106874852012-11-19T15:51:06.180-05:002012-11-19T15:51:06.180-05:00Anthony, I agree with that. And I don't mean ...Anthony, I agree with that. And I don't mean to imply that I accept that Obama made a particular bribe offer which won people over. What I'm saying is that the Democrats have gotten very good at hooking people on government so that it's in their interests to keep supporting the Democrats. I think that is a huge factor.<br /><br />But what truly drives the turn out is exactly what you are saying -- fear.<br /><br />Throughout my entire lifetime, the Democrats have peddled fear to their base. They warn blacks that whites are racist and the Republicans want to be the white party who will return them to the age of Jim Crow. They tell women that Republicans are sexist and want them barefoot and pregnant in the home. They tell Hispanics that Republicans are Anglos who want to ship them all home so they don't pollute our culture. They tell Jews that Republicans are religious nuts who want to purify the country along theological grounds. They tell poor white males that Republicans are rich capitalists who want to ship their jobs overseas.<br /><br />These things never really worked until the 1990s when the Republicans began selling fear as well. Until that time the Republicans were about prosperity. But beginning with Pat Buchanan and his culture war speech, the Republicans began telling white Christians that the Democrats wanted to undo everything they believed in and force gays, blacks, uppity women, Mexican culture, etc. onto them. Bush added big business cronyism to the mix and outsourcing. In the 2000s, they added deportation. In effect, they played right into the Democratic propaganda and we are paying for that now.<br />AndrewPricehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-28829455033509743912012-11-19T15:39:14.973-05:002012-11-19T15:39:14.973-05:00I agree that the groups we are discussing backed t...I agree that the groups we are discussing backed the wrong horse, I just disagree as to why (I suspect it was fear rather than greed).<br /><br />If people merely wanted benefits, they would have shown up in 2010 (that loss pretty much destroyed Obama's ability to get liberal legislation passed). <br /><br />This time around the main goal of the Obama campaign wasn't defending his past policies or selling his future ones, but on painting an ugly picture of Romney and the Republican party. <br /><br />As I've noted before, in the case of Hispanics, Romney supplied the paint back in the primaries. In the case of blacks, Democrats seized upon the cutting down of early voting days and the requirement of ids as 'voter suppression' (which was actually an argument an idiotic local republican advanced at one point).<br /><br />http://www.humanevents.com/2012/11/14/voter-id-laws-energized-liberal-base-in-pennsylvania/<br /><br />In the case of women, every insane comment on rape or bizarre on air fantasy about a minor political activist was played up and cited as evidence of the real thinking of the party.<br /><br />Even the white males that compose the majority of the Republican base at the moment must have bought into Obama admin's picture of Romney as a guy who cared primarily about other rich people people because fewer of them turned out in 2012 than 2008 (and even fewer in swing states, where anti-Romney advertising was heaviest).Anthonyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16124128949343301445noreply@blogger.com