tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post5061427004203685074..comments2024-01-05T06:18:18.086-05:00Comments on CommentaramaPolitics: The Democratic Rage ProblemAndrewPricehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.comBlogger28125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-80110312421242000092017-06-26T18:38:47.404-04:002017-06-26T18:38:47.404-04:00Tryanmax,
None of those guys have called for assa...Tryanmax,<br /><br />None of those guys have called for assassination but all have been happy to spread crazy talk when it suited their purposes. Crazy talk sometimes makes crazy people do crazy things.<br /><br />*Shrugs* There's nothing really to be done about it. Freedom of speech is a fundamental right and they aren't really responsible for violence committed by others. <br /><br />A nutjob on edge enough to kill because of talk would have killed someone eventually anyway. <br /><br />The unlovely truth is that people lie, exaggerate and slander all the time. The system getting involved for anything but direct threats or calls for murder would be a cure worse than the disease so the best thing is to let things continue as they are. <br /><br />We can all act shocked when someone is killed, observe a brief period of solemnity then go back to business as usual.Anthonyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16124128949343301445noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-39800749611702289632017-06-26T18:32:42.002-04:002017-06-26T18:32:42.002-04:00Anthony, Nope, I do remember that. Ug.
I agree w...Anthony, Nope, I do remember that. Ug.<br /><br />I agree with you. I think this started under Bush II. The election laid the groundwork for an unprecedented level of disrespect and then Iraq brought out genuine hate and people pushing the boundaries of acceptable speech.<br /><br />Under Obama, I think you had something similar on the far right fringe, but otherwise things were a good deal more clam. The left, however, looked at the GOP stopping Obama's agenda (ignoring the lack of an agenda) and combined it with what their bloggers told them about the right-fringe and they decided that all bets were off.<br /><br />Now with even the "legitimate left" throwing a tantrum, these more fringey types have gone nuts and think they can do anything.<br /><br />So I agree with you that it started under Bush II. Not sure where it will end though.AndrewPricehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-31391024268001104542017-06-26T18:28:27.446-04:002017-06-26T18:28:27.446-04:00Daniel, The thing is...
The human race has always...Daniel, The thing is...<br /><br />The human race has always had its sick elements. There has always been a segment of the population that is ruled by emotion (mainly bad) and superstition rather than intelligence. These people are spiteful, hateful, xenophobic, jealous little monsters with little "humanity" in them.<br /><br />As a general rule, these people have been kept in ghettos and backwaters and prisons. Some have managed to live in polite society, but usually blow it badly at some point. In the past, no one paid them much attention because they are worthless and they are directionless. They are drifters through life causing troubling to everyone they touch, but lacking the ability or drive to touch very many people.<br /><br />But with the internet and the advent of talk radio, these people have found a place where they can insert themselves and feel important. They are internet trolls. They are people who fight nasty battles on talk radio over politics or sports. They have made themselves into armchair Napoleons debunking the world that eludes them and trying to make it burn.<br /><br />For the most part, they are still just basement dwelling losers jerking themselves off into thinking they have f*cked with better people. Unfortunately, our media is increasingly using these people to shock audiences into paying attention -- and some see them as a natural market now (like talk radio). The end result is that their sick views are being given a credibility they don't deserve, which encourages them to get worse.<br /><br />Every time Johnny Depp jokes about killing Trump, a thousand of these *ssholes feel vindicated and they try that much harder. That's really the problem.AndrewPricehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-88476146984244887712017-06-26T18:27:25.552-04:002017-06-26T18:27:25.552-04:00Andrew,
I agree its at a new level. My point is ...Andrew,<br /><br />I agree its at a new level. My point is this is a pattern that began during Bush II and has steadily gotten worse. I agree things are worse than ever now because the left is so violent.<br /><br />Tell people that your political opponent is a secret agent of an enemy power, that he is secretly selling drugs to kill a community, planning to enslave or kill them, or running a child pornography ring out of a pizzaria, people who take you seriously (most won't), will do something violent because those are horrible things. <br /><br />Celebs calling for death of a president is more common now than ever before, but like I've pointed out before, Nugent promised to murder Obama and Trump embraced him and once he won, invited him to the White House. The establishment at the time denounced Nugent, but that didn't meant much in the medium term.<br /><br />I agree people killing these some of these crazy talking celebs is the next logical step in the pattern but I don't think that it will lead to a de-escalation (quite the opposite).<br /><br />PS - Don't tell me you forgot infamous 2006 Bush assassination movie 'Death of a President'. Nobody watched it, but it got quite a bit of coverage in its day.Anthonyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16124128949343301445noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-74202958539759573052017-06-26T18:13:41.248-04:002017-06-26T18:13:41.248-04:00Nothing I can really add to that, Andrew, except h...Nothing I can really add to that, Andrew, except how depressing and infuriating that it is that it's come to this. Things really have hit a violent, cult-like level with these nutbags and I'm not seeing much will to bring things under control either from anyone.ArgentGalehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01173296751792700318noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-34531796628551897712017-06-26T17:06:13.898-04:002017-06-26T17:06:13.898-04:00Anthony, I'm not sure what you mean to suggest...Anthony, I'm not sure what you mean to suggest by bringing up Rush, Drudge, Beck and Jones. I've listened to Rush and Beck for years and have never heard anything out of either that even approaches what's currently coming out of the left. I can't speak to Drudge except that his name never comes up when the topic is incitement. I know Jones is wont to issue "meet me out back" type invites, so maybe that's something. <br /><br />Anyway, my only point is that there are dramatic differences both in the type of rhetoric coming out of the various factions and the ways said rhetoric is portrayed. False equivalence ("Oh dear, we're just as bad.") is the trap the right falls into again and again. tryanmaxhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09881154741574720094noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-79717646761585736842017-06-26T16:41:28.706-04:002017-06-26T16:41:28.706-04:00Bev, That's the problem. The solution is to a...Bev, That's the problem. The solution is to arrest and punish people who make death threats. Pure and simple. But that's not how human operate. They won't want to be bothered prosecuting those people and will instead call for more laws to solve the problem. In the meantime, it will become a game played by the reckless who don't realize that the crazies are taking them seriously.AndrewPricehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-73516653867817060062017-06-26T16:39:06.148-04:002017-06-26T16:39:06.148-04:00Daniel, Honestly, I don't think this will reso...Daniel, Honestly, I don't think this will resolve well.<br /><br />First, I doubt they will prosecute these people to make them stop. That will instead lead to calls for vast, overbearing laws that let the left punish free speech, but won't actually work against these people.<br /><br />Secondly, I suspect we're seeing the beginning of tit for tat death threat-ing. As a solution, that may slow things down, but it's a horrible solution.<br /><br />So we'll see, but I don't think this will end well. The problem is the left won't stop until the right makes them stop and by that point you a new normal of mutually assured destruction.AndrewPricehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-24885554968280312762017-06-26T16:33:32.747-04:002017-06-26T16:33:32.747-04:00Anthony, A couple points.
First, finding a couple...Anthony, A couple points.<br /><br />First, finding a couple conservatives who have done something similar in no way addresses the main point. There have always been nuts. The issue is the widespread nature of these nuts and the tacit encouragement from the top.<br /><br />Secondly, Drudge, Rush and Beck have never crossed any of these lines that leftists are now routinely crossing. Few have, right or left, until now. Even in the Micheal Moore hate-filled anti-Bush years, there were only a handful of examples of people calling for Bush to be assassinated and no one with a public platform did that. This is a massive leap forward in terms of the depravity level.<br /><br />The worry that I am seeing celebrities get now is rather ironic. They are starting to get death threats for saying these things. Basically, the gander is catching up to the goose. That's where we are headed next... which is not a good thing.<br /><br />AndrewPricehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-64996314143489021392017-06-26T15:17:27.070-04:002017-06-26T15:17:27.070-04:00Tryanmax,
I don't claim to know their backgro...Tryanmax,<br /><br />I don't claim to know their backgrounds, but Rush, Drudge, Beck and Alex Jones all boast millions of followers. <br /><br />I agree college professors are the ones doing the most damage due to who their audience is That and the fact they are part of institutions which take public money makes reform realistic. <br /><br />Celebs on the other hand don't have too much to worry about unless they put a lot of daylight between themselves and their fans (Dixie Chicks being exhibit A) or get a lot of work from controversy adverse institutions (Kathy Griffin). The Robert De Niros and Snoop Doggs of the world don't really have leashes for anyone to grab.Anthonyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16124128949343301445noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-5983235845489761382017-06-26T15:03:27.217-04:002017-06-26T15:03:27.217-04:00See, I told you this would happen. People used to...See, I told you this would happen. People used to be able to indiscreetly blurt out stupid things in private amongst friends in the room amd get away with it. The people in room may have thought a little less of you, but there was no permanent record. Like when my brother at 7 yrs old in Dallas on the day JFK was shot in his 2nd grade class - "Why is everyone so upset about Kennedy being shot. My parents hated him!". Other than a family story, there is no permanent record and no harm done except for a few pearl clutchers in the moment.<br /><br />What we now have the ability to indiscreetly blurt out our endless word "farts" (pardon my verbiage) to our "friends" in the global social E-verse for all the world to see within minutes and permanently...including politicians and celebrities who think there will be no consequences to making literally incendiary "Burn the Traitors" type of statements and "jokes" about "assassinate the president...please!" and the like. <br /><br />All that being said, anyone who harms/tries to harm or destroy property, people or animals in the act of "political" demonstrations should be arrested on the spot. The tricky part is the very thin line criminalizing "incitement". Do we really want to go the way of the EU, UK, and Canada and start arresing people for harsh words? It's a very slippery slope.<br /><br />Anywho...NEWSBREAK...the SCOTUS vote to reinstate the travel ban for 90 days and taking up this issue for Fall arguments was passed 9-0. So, no one can blame Gorsuch for this. I retract my previous incendiary indictment of anticipated liberal twitter-accusations and apologize if anyone took offense.BevfromNYChttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14953050916932306270noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-26369254299430884622017-06-26T14:40:53.313-04:002017-06-26T14:40:53.313-04:00…crazy talk on the left side is mostly from celebs...<i>…crazy talk on the left side is mostly from celebs and professors…</i><br /><br />The former of which have national platforms, and the latter of which have a platform to impressionable minds. Crazy talk on the right is mostly from Midwestern blue collar folks who wouldn't be a blip on the radar if the left-side media weren't so eager for examples of how "unhinged" conservatives are. tryanmaxhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09881154741574720094noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-44508778848115067592017-06-26T14:34:25.881-04:002017-06-26T14:34:25.881-04:00I've seen several times where they tried to bl...<i>I've seen several times where they tried to block her from speaking or tried to chase her back to her car afterwards.</i><br /><br />I've seen that, too. Utterly appalling! Imagine if the other party were in charge. It would fill the airwaves. tryanmaxhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09881154741574720094noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-1083900479718057262017-06-26T14:27:13.483-04:002017-06-26T14:27:13.483-04:00Well, liberal heads will be exploding again, SCOTU...Well, liberal heads will be exploding again, SCOTUS upheld Trump's travel ban and they will hear the full case in the fall...Critchhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07106908233705403513noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-73684473107963414292017-06-26T14:22:59.684-04:002017-06-26T14:22:59.684-04:00I hope you're right, Andrew. Arresting the rio...I hope you're right, Andrew. Arresting the rioters and credible threats should definitely be in the cards and I don't think the public is going to feel sorry for them. The Secretary of Education getting threats is definitely unusual, too, yet I'm not surprised. I've seen a LOT of hate aimed towards her and there were reports of white powder being sent to Karen Handel's house during the special election, too. No one was hurt, thankfully. I hope you're right about the celebrities settling down, too, but somehow I think that this is just going to fuel their egos, especially if one does end up getting killed. ArgentGalehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01173296751792700318noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-2135461146812265542017-06-26T12:44:02.818-04:002017-06-26T12:44:02.818-04:00Andrew,
1) The level of violence is without moder...Andrew,<br /><br />1) The level of violence is without modern precedent and overwhelmingly liberal but crazy talk on the left side is mostly from celebs and professors, both groups are outside the party apparatus. They get denounced by elected leaders, but neither they nor their fans cared (people who generate income for them can make them care).<br /><br />2) The direct nature of the threats is because crazy talk is a crowded, competitive arena. Calls for coups are common in recent history (the second person still holds elected office and to the best of my knowledge the party never denounced her) but generally they don't generate much worry if the crazy talker isn't wearing a uniform.<br /><br />https://thinkprogress.org/retired-army-general-to-tea-party-group-i-would-lead-a-coup-against-the-u-s-government-43a91f51de8a?gi=937a9cf0540e. Vallely has called made his comments in a discussion with an Arizona-based Tea Party group last December, a recording of which the website Right Wing Watch recently acquired. “I had a call this afternoon from Idaho, the gentleman said, ‘If I give you 250,000 Marines to go to Washington, will you lead them?’” Vallely, who was Fox News’ senior military analyst during the Iraq War, told the group. “I said, ‘Yes, I will, I’ll surround the White House and I’ll surround the Capitol building, but it’s going to take physical presence to do things.”<br />-----<br />A former military expert at Frank Gaffney’s right-wing Center for Security Policy, Vallely shares his former employer’s support of the birther movement. He has been quoted as saying that’s he has had “retired CIA agents and other investigators go over [Obama’s] birth certificate that was produced and by far ten out of ten have said its a forgery.” Given the inability of previous far-right efforts to rally massive amounts of people to DC to promote conspiracies, however, Vallely’s endorsement of both the hypothetical coup and Operation: American Spring may not go far.<br /><br />http://www.cnn.com/2014/10/15/politics/missouri-county-official-military-coup-barack-obama/index.html<br /><br />Jefferson County Recorder of Deeds Debbie Dunnegan called President Barack Obama "our domestic enemy" and suggested the U.S. Constitution would give the U.S. military the authority to oust the president in a coup d'état, the St. Louis Post-Dispatch reported Wednesday.<br />"I cannot and do not understand why no action is being taken against our domestic enemy. I know he is supposedly the commander in chief, but the Constitution gives you the authority. What am I missing?" Dunnegan, a Republican, wrote in a since-deleted Facebook post.<br /><br />Rush cheered when the guy who went on to win election beat a reporter for asking him a budget question (the Republican leadership denounced the attack and the guy later apologized). Wasn't viewed as a big deal. It's what should be expected of the fringe. It's the world we live in.Anthonyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16124128949343301445noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-1612972990384460812017-06-26T12:32:03.460-04:002017-06-26T12:32:03.460-04:00tryanmax, The left has been flirting with poison h...tryanmax, The left has been flirting with poison here and, as always, it's going to bite them in the ass. It's not possible to encourage only the crazies from one side.AndrewPricehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-48695306910551940912017-06-26T12:29:04.758-04:002017-06-26T12:29:04.758-04:00Bev, Surprise! As I've said all along, there i...Bev, Surprise! As I've said all along, there is no legitimate basis to object to this. It's all within the President's power. And if Obama had done it, the left would have said the same the whole time. This was just politics.<br /><br />P.S. Now we get see if any of the "the world will end" claims by the left come true! Apparently, all of our doctors come from those six countries and still need to get here. And our colleges are filled with travelers from those countries. Could be tough times ahead... or it was all bullsh*t. AndrewPricehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-65281327836157991152017-06-26T12:26:08.082-04:002017-06-26T12:26:08.082-04:00Daniel, They have become unhinged.
What's it ...Daniel, They have become unhinged.<br /><br />What's it going to take? Either you start arresting people who make threats and try to intimidate, or you let this system run out of control.<br /><br />That said, I think you're going see fewer leftists celebs spouting off in the future eventually. Right now, they are starting to get a lot of death threats when they do this crap. So far, they are just whining about it. But I do suspect that at some point a Depp or a Griffin will get themselves killed. Then the left will demand changes to the laws and will also learn to shut the hell up. That's my guess.AndrewPricehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-54937767191323987342017-06-26T12:23:13.433-04:002017-06-26T12:23:13.433-04:00tyanmax, The Devos one struck me too. What has go...tyanmax, The Devos one struck me too. What has gone wrong when a Secretary of Education is receiving death threats. The issue is, of course, that the left haunts colleges. It is their last playground and they aren't going to let her change any part of it.<br /><br />But apparently, the number of credible threats against her is staggering. And I've seen several times where they tried to block her from speaking or tried to chase her back to her car afterwards.AndrewPricehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-57093492731226871792017-06-26T12:08:29.182-04:002017-06-26T12:08:29.182-04:00Bev, RE: the SCOTUS ruling. It's my understand...Bev, RE: the SCOTUS ruling. It's my understanding that the affected agencies anticipated this and have been working on what they can in spite of the judicial stays. We'll know for sure in 72 hours. tryanmaxhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09881154741574720094noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-72431196874593931452017-06-26T12:06:20.020-04:002017-06-26T12:06:20.020-04:00"Yet today, the leaders of the left flirt wit...<i>"Yet today, the leaders of the left flirt with this stuff."</i><br /><br />You misspelled "vigorously hump." tryanmaxhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09881154741574720094noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-74108071962812684862017-06-26T11:57:21.055-04:002017-06-26T11:57:21.055-04:00I'm halfway down the list. Had to pause to rea...I'm halfway down the list. Had to pause to react to this: <br /><br /><i>Betsy Devos is under Marshal protection because of the number of credible threats she gets.</i><br /><br />Since when does the frickin' <b>S̲e̲c̲r̲e̲t̲a̲r̲y ̲o̲f̲ ̲E̲d̲u̲c̲a̲t̲i̲o̲n̲</b> receive threats!?!? This is madness!!!tryanmaxhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09881154741574720094noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-91662527012224312762017-06-26T11:23:39.352-04:002017-06-26T11:23:39.352-04:00Excellent article on a disturbing phenomenon. I...Excellent article on a disturbing phenomenon. I've heard about most of the celebrity statements though on Scalise most of the comments I've heard aimed at the Republicans in general was how they brought it on themselves by not supporting gun control mixed in with comments about how horrible it must have been for one of the police officers who defended him to have to do so for a racist, homophobic, oppressor Republican (said officer is black and a lesbian). This really has gotten way out of hand. I'll be damned if I know what it's going to take to end this mess, though. ArgentGalehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01173296751792700318noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-12973893015968859962017-06-26T10:59:02.618-04:002017-06-26T10:59:02.618-04:00NEWS FLASH****This just in from the AP wire...
WA...NEWS FLASH****This just in from the AP wire...<br /><br />WASHINGTON (AP) — The Supreme Court is letting the Trump administration enforce its 90-day ban on travelers from six mostly Muslim countries, overturning lower court orders that blocked it.<br />The action Monday is a victory for President Donald Trump in the biggest legal controversy of his young presidency.<br />Trump said last week that the ban would take effect 72 hours being cleared by courts.<br />The justices will hear arguments in the case in the fall.<br /><br />****Interesting. Oh, cue the "THIS IS GORSUCH'S FAULT! HE WAS ILLEGALLY VOTED TO SC! IMPEACH...blah, blah, blah"BevfromNYChttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14953050916932306270noreply@blogger.com