tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post3789890287977823730..comments2024-01-05T06:18:18.086-05:00Comments on CommentaramaPolitics: Gun Control And Swiss SuicidesAndrewPricehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.comBlogger29125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-3524337532973939352011-02-16T22:40:52.082-05:002011-02-16T22:40:52.082-05:00Jed, To give you a sense, they had 51 murders in 2...Jed, To give you a sense, they had 51 murders in 2009 and 185 attempted murders, 666 rapes and and about 2600 arrests for causing bodily injury. With a population of almost 8 million people, that's very insignificant.<br><br>As I mention in the article, their violent crime rate is 1/100th that of England.<br><br>And I think this is largely cultural, because the Swiss are a very orderly people, just like the Japanese. But again, that means the key is culture, not guns.<br><br>On registration, I personally don't have a problem with registration either, as long as it doesn't turn into confiscation. But I no longer trust that registration isn't just a ploy for confiscation. Basically, the gun control lobby has squandered any good will they had with me by lying and playing the trojan horse game, and I no longer trust their motives enough to agree to anything with them.AndrewPricehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-71737186620033837972011-02-16T21:59:51.420-05:002011-02-16T21:59:51.420-05:00I would be curious about the overall crime rates i...I would be curious about the overall crime rates in Switzerland or the frequency of violent crime there. Where a culture of lawlessness exists, I suspect the level of violent crime, including crimes with guns goes up. The reality in this country is that we have a constitutional right to bear arms. I have no problems registering them. In fact, I once read there is a potentialto make fire arms in the future that would have leave unique markings on the spent bullet. Thus, if a bullet is recovered, it could be traced to a specific gun. Sounds like an interesting concept.Tennessee Jedhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/10604275115906776992noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-6858454496668893932011-02-16T18:04:16.922-05:002011-02-16T18:04:16.922-05:00USS Ben, Thanks! I think you're right on all ...USS Ben, Thanks! I think you're right on all points.<br><br>For all that the police are capable of doing, their main ability is to pick up the pieces after the fact and to search for and arrest the criminal -- it is truly rare that they can stop a crime as it is occurring.<br><br>And to use another cliche, better alive and in legal trouble than dead.<br><br>I think it's absolutely true that criminals think twice before going after people who might be armed. That's just human nature. We weigh risks and rewards. When the risks are too high because you're likely to get killed, then you don't take the risk... it's that simple.<br><br>The risk of being killed trying to break into a house is a significant deterrent. The risk that you might eventually get caught and could be made to serve a couple years in an unpleasant but not horrible prison isn't nearly as big of a risk.<br><br>But liberals don't want to think this way because if they grasped that people made decisions based on risk and reward, then they would also grasp that much of their other theories (which rely on the idea that people are static and will not change their behaviors in response to incentives) would fall apart.<br><br>In other words, if they admit that criminals are acting rationally, then (1) they would have to admit the criminals are not victims, but are instead predators, and (2) they would realize that doing things like handing money to people will cause them to become dependent. They don't want to believe that.<br><br>Plus, all of that again argues against the government controlling every aspect of our lives.AndrewPricehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-83707375364191744802011-02-16T17:49:03.648-05:002011-02-16T17:49:03.648-05:00Excellent post, Andrew!Another cliche that happens...Excellent post, Andrew!<br><br>Another cliche that happens to be true is:<br><br>An armed society is a polite society.<br><br>If a criminal even suspects that a homeowner owns a gun that is a far bigger deterrent than burgler alarms, neighborhood watch signs, the off chance that the home occupants know kung fu, or the police.<br><br>Big dogs can be a nice deterrent but not everyone can own them (for various reasons).<br><br>Leftists seem to have a lot of faith in alarms, signs and the police.<br><br>However, seasoned burglers, rapists, serial killers, etc., know that even if they trip an alarm, unless a cop happens to be within a block or two, they have (easily) 5-10 minutes to do whatever they want (and often longer, particularly in larger cities or rural areas).<br><br>No, the truth is, more often than not, the police won't get to your house in time to protect you.<br><br>I have the utmost respect for cops but they can't do the impossible and be everywhere at the same time like leftists expect them to be.<br><br>To make matters worse, in leftist controlled cities, counties and states they have a skeleton crew, bare bones in numbers police departments, and whenever they need to make cuts to their heavily indebted budgets they choose to cut the police first...as a form of extortion to get folks to agree to raise taxes, rather than cut their pet overbloated bureaucracies and programs that do more damage than good.<br><br>It's not a coincidence that both criminals and most democrats (and a few republicans) want more gun control. <br>It's not so much guns they wanna control, they wanna control us.USS Ben USN (Ret)http://www.blogger.com/profile/07492369604790651538noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-38458778983600122462011-02-16T14:46:02.993-05:002011-02-16T14:46:02.993-05:00Lawhawk, LOL! So true. :-)Lawhawk, LOL! So true. :-)AndrewPricehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-44394540836873498912011-02-16T14:42:18.762-05:002011-02-16T14:42:18.762-05:00Andrew: And so endeth the lesson. Amen!Andrew: And so endeth the lesson. Amen!LawHawkRFDhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/17800255923675295515noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-71460068567894172042011-02-16T14:38:52.353-05:002011-02-16T14:38:52.353-05:00Lawhawk, That's exactly the point the left doe...Lawhawk, That's exactly the point the left doesn't want people making because (1) that doesn't lead to the elimination of guns (which makes it easier to run an abusive government, and (2) it means we need to focus on decades of failed liberalism in places like Oakland and Cleveland and we need to change the <i>culture</i> in those places. Personal responsibility, rule of law, and respect for the property and lives of others.... all anathema to liberal thinkers.AndrewPricehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-25588280803856745842011-02-16T14:35:51.642-05:002011-02-16T14:35:51.642-05:00The Swiss have always mandated gun ownership for n...The Swiss have always <i>mandated</i> gun ownership for national defense, rather than merely tolerate it. Every potential invader from the outside or burglar from the inside knows that, and combined with a population that believes in the rule of law, you have an extremely low rate of death or injury from guns. Vermont is our Switzerland--extremely liberal ownership and conceal-carry laws, a homogeneous and largely law-abiding population and a death or injury rate by gun that rivals Switzerland. Anybody remember the last time they had a big gang shootout in Switzerland--or Vermont? Although I've always disdained cliches, many are often true. One of the truest: "Guns don't kill people, people kill people." Look to the nature and upbringing of your people, not to the brand, quantity or quality of their guns.LawHawkRFDhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/17800255923675295515noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-55038398811998597422011-02-16T14:22:12.086-05:002011-02-16T14:22:12.086-05:00Thanks Crispy!Thanks Crispy!AndrewPricehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-90074038284690740942011-02-16T14:19:29.199-05:002011-02-16T14:19:29.199-05:00Great article, Andrew!Great article, Andrew!CrispyRicehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07302075204880024936noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-90684349865957407192011-02-16T14:12:21.522-05:002011-02-16T14:12:21.522-05:00Joel, Very true! I never thought of that before, b...Joel, Very true! I never thought of that before, but Goldberg's stuff is smarter than liberalism them. LOL!AndrewPricehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-51306195901854956412011-02-16T14:06:00.369-05:002011-02-16T14:06:00.369-05:00Andrew,Compared to Liberal Logic(Oxymoron), Rube G...Andrew,<br><br>Compared to Liberal Logic(Oxymoron), Rube Goldberg's designs are straight. Plus Goldberg's designs work.Joel Farnhamhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/15856960977033430002noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-75125138536549262012011-02-16T13:53:52.980-05:002011-02-16T13:53:52.980-05:00Aw…Bev, those are the special things that make lif...Aw…Bev, those are the special things that make life livable. My day is unfulfilled unless I can toy with a Trotsky.StanHhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07395708786509590321noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-60598197716931395102011-02-16T13:17:08.160-05:002011-02-16T13:17:08.160-05:00Bev, I figured you might revolt on us if I didn...Bev, I figured you might revolt on us if I didn't match the reds, so I did! :-)<br><br><br>And don't give anyone any ideas about regulating our content. There are far too many liberals who would happily take that kind of job! Not that we would listen. . . :-)AndrewPricehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-7573896791725907732011-02-16T13:15:43.635-05:002011-02-16T13:15:43.635-05:00Joel, Very true. They will happily say you can ha...Joel, Very true. They will happily say you can have a gun, so long as it doesn't work and can't ever be used. But of course, at that point, "why do you need a gun anyway? Better to just ban them since they serve no purpose."<br><br>In fact, they go to truly Rube Goldberian explanations for how guns can be used. For example, suppose you don't have kids, then how can safety locks save kids? Well.... you could be gone one day and someone might steal it and hand it to neighborhood kids, who could then use it to shoot each other. Uh huh.<br><br>Of course, the one thing liberals try very hard to avoid mentioning is that guns are an equalizer, they protect the weak from the strong. A gun can help a 95 pound woman stop a 265 pound man, or can save a homeowner from a group of home invaders. They always want to ignore that because they pathologically hate guns.<br><br>I think Ed is right that the reason they hate guns so much has to do with freedom. Guns like cars and stand alone homes represent freedom... and freedom means not letting the government run every facet of your life. Liberals hate that because they think everyone's lives should be run by a panel of experts who can do it so much better than you.AndrewPricehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-62300053667101942282011-02-16T12:49:42.604-05:002011-02-16T12:49:42.604-05:00Oh, FYI Andrew - YEY, you matched the reds! Now I...Oh, FYI Andrew - YEY, you matched the reds! Now I won't have to go away...BevfromNYChttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14953050916932306270noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-53054211928777838532011-02-16T12:49:04.900-05:002011-02-16T12:49:04.900-05:00StanH, we must be careful. If our articles start m...StanH, we must be careful. If our articles start making liberals' heads explode spontaneously, then they will try and get a law regulating what we can say...BevfromNYChttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14953050916932306270noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-52747478877804630102011-02-16T12:45:04.851-05:002011-02-16T12:45:04.851-05:00Andrew,As StanH says, "...it makes liberals h...Andrew,<br><br>As StanH says, "...it makes liberals heads explode."<br><br>Good article. It sounds like GDS is alive and kicking. Gun Derangement Syndrome. Only detected in liberals. ;-)<br><br>There is also an idiotic restriction that is imposed on people to help keep "the children" safe. Gun locks. Sure you can keep this "dangerous and totally unnecessary gun" at home. You just have to have a lock on it. It's because a child can get to your gun and kill his/her self or any one else that gun locks should be utilized.<br><br>This is of course designed to keep guns "safe" from hurting children. In actually renders a gun useless to you or anyone else. This is the companion law to you can't carry the gun around.<br><br>Liberals say it is okay to keep guns, Second Amendment and all that, but:<br><br>A) You can't carry it around.<br>B) You MUST keep it inoperable when not in immediate use at a gun range.<br><br>Which totally shreds the purpose of the Second Amendment.Joel Farnhamhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/15856960977033430002noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-77172739142237665672011-02-16T12:43:43.402-05:002011-02-16T12:43:43.402-05:00Ed, I agree. Guns are just one in a long list of ...Ed, I agree. Guns are just one in a long list of freedoms the left wants you to give up. They want to control all facets of your life. And that's not paranoia, look at the way they want to regulate what you can eat, what you can drive (control the speed you can drive and if you wear seatbelts -- or helmets on bikes), force you to have health care, force you to send your kids to public indoctrination, where you can live, what kinds of business you can shop at, control what you can see on television and hear on the radio, etc. etc.<br><br>The list never ends. The left wants to run every single moment of your life.AndrewPricehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-8176143483238737222011-02-16T12:39:40.186-05:002011-02-16T12:39:40.186-05:00I am not surprised the gun control lobby would lie...I am not surprised the gun control lobby would lie about any of this. They hate guns, just like they hate cars and the other things that make Americans free, and if they can eliminate guns in a place like Switzerland, then they can isolate the US. Nice article.Ednoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-59957850607987378112011-02-16T12:10:39.750-05:002011-02-16T12:10:39.750-05:00LimeyLibertarian,I agree entirely. The guns are s...LimeyLibertarian,<br><br>I agree entirely. The guns are simply a tool these people use, they are not a cause. And they are not even unique tools, so even if guns disappeared tomorrow, nothing would change -- people who want to commit suicide will find a way, whether they have access to guns or not. They can jump from buildings, poison themselves, step in front of trains (which is apparently a huge problem in Germany), etc. etc.<br><br>What I've always found most disingenuous about the anti-gun arguments is that they want to take guns away from law abiding people who don't use the guns for any bad purpose in the hopes that this will somehow stop predators who don't care about the laws. That makes no sense at all!<br><br>That's like putting speed regulators on bicycles to slow down cars. It completely misses the mark.<br><br>What I think it's really about is freeing the government from the fear that it's people can stand up to it. When the government knows that its people have the power to stand up to it, the government tends to avoid overreaching.AndrewPricehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-58512102268609959492011-02-16T11:59:57.257-05:002011-02-16T11:59:57.257-05:00Ponderosa, There is a famous quote that I've r...Ponderosa, There is a famous quote that I've remember for years now. The King of Prussia (right around the time Germany was unified) was visiting the Swiss and he noticed that the Swiss army was only 40,000 men.<br><br>When he said, "what would you do if I sent 40,000 men into Switzerland." A Swiss general replied: "Each of my men would shoot once."<br><br>When the Prussian said, "what would you do if I sent 400,000 men," the Swiss general responded, "Then each of my men would shoot ten times."<br><br>The lesson was that the Swiss people are trained marksmen who all own guns and you simply could not invade the country without losing way more soldiers than it would be worth. So far, no one has been willing to test that -- even Hitler.AndrewPricehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-39149817240993960882011-02-16T11:54:21.724-05:002011-02-16T11:54:21.724-05:00Also, Stan, another good example: do you remember...Also, Stan, another good example: do you remember the study in the 1990s that found the Virginia was supplying the guns used by criminals all along the East Coast? That study was used to push through a limit on the number of guns you could buy. Well, it turns out the study was done in NYC on the guns they could trace. . . a total of 5 guns. Four of those came from Virginia. That's such shoddy statistics that anyone who signed off on that report should lose their math degree and have their calculator seized, yet the media ran with this report and kept telling everyone "Virginia is the armory for criminals all along the Eastern seaboard."<br><br>Ridiculous!AndrewPricehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-34309009316590004322011-02-16T11:50:47.308-05:002011-02-16T11:50:47.308-05:00Stan, There is a direct correlation between gun ow...Stan, There is a direct correlation between gun ownership and a serious dip in crime. What the left does to cover this up, is they do fake studies to prove that crime goes up -- then the MSM only reports on those studies instead of the dozens that show the opposite.<br><br>I've seen these studies lump in even petty vandalism (which way outnumbers more serious crimes) to hide the effect, lump in large urban areas that did not have high gun ownership rates into the "gun ownership" area and then compare those to only rural areas, and I've seen them "factor out" unexplained factors that somehow made the crime in the "no gun" areas disappear.<br><br>But we're not stupid. First, we understand that crooks look for the easy target -- that's why they pick the homes without the burglar alarms. And that's why the anti-gun people freak out when someone suggests identifying homes that do and don't have guns.<br><br>Secondly, we have great examples all over the place. I used to live in Arlington, Virginia, which is inside the beltway just across the river from Washington D.C. Everyone in VA has a gun and the crime and murder rates are really, really low. Across the river, in basically the same concentration of city and with as many minorities, you had the murder capital of the world. In DC only the bad guys had guns. If guns are so dangerous then why wasn't that reversed? Why wasn't DC safe and free and northern Virginia a murderous hell hole?AndrewPricehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6251675227852122352.post-65215951859672250722011-02-16T11:29:39.352-05:002011-02-16T11:29:39.352-05:00T_Rav, Yep, you're right. Handgun Control, In...T_Rav, Yep, you're right. Handgun Control, Inc. has been putting out various PR releases stating for some time that Switzerland has some of the toughest gun control laws in the world, none of which is true. By American standards, they are nearly unregulated. And most Swiss households have them.<br><br>The problem is that Switzerland blows a hole in the liberal theories about gun ownership and gun control.<br><br>And when you take away guns or lack of gun control as the cause of violence, then (1) there's no reason to take away guns and (2) you need to find another cause to explain why so many people are killing each other in Detroit and Cleveland.... and that's the other thing the liberals don't want you looking at, because those places have fallen apart because of 60 years of intense liberal experimentation.AndrewPricehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11312364467936820986noreply@blogger.com